To make long story short...after 3.5 months living in a camper, my h decided to spend the weekend at our house. He has been going to counseling and I had a few sessions myself. On Sat. nite, I went upstairs to go to bed, but instead started reading "the 5 love language" as recommended by counselor and I came upon a section dealing with infidelity. I wanted to read it together, but instead found him in his van talking to OW on cell phone and in time to hear him say he loved her...I literally flipped out and started beating on him. I told him to leave and never come back, which he wouldn't. We fought/talked til 3 am. I left and went to bed and he came up and said he was sorry. The next morning, he told me and my 17 yr. old daughter that we would be moving forward and that we wouldn't be living in limbo. He moved back home that day. He hides his cell phone and the other day I smelled perfume on his work shirt. I told him that I loved him enough to let him go if he was happier with ow on several occasions. Gave him forgiveness and trust, the latter alot harder than I thought. Why would he move home and continue to pay for counseling and still carry on with ow??? Have appt. with attorney to find out what my rights are. He is a very controlling person and maybe that's the answer to the ? above. Have 3 children: 10, 12, and 17. I am 50 and h is 43. I have bent over backwards to work on our marriage...he says he is too, but honestly don't see it. This past Sat. he was in a good mood, then for no apparent reason his mood turned sour and he was nasty to our children and of course my 10 yr. old didn't know what he had done wrong. Can you save a marriage when your h can't make up his mind what he wants? What is the purpose of counseling if he will not follow her advice? He was still with her when we started counseling, but on Apr. 23 he broke it off or so he said. He told me he had been seeing her since Fall on and off again. Think he mixes truth with lies...very frustrating. counselor told him not to respond to any calls or txt, but sure enough he did. That was the main reason she decided to counsel him alone...she has to fix him before she can fix us. How long shall I hang on? Will it ever end? Think it may be necessary to have him removed from the premises, trust me he would be shocked by that because I've never stood up to him. When I would, he would react in a way that I would be scared and back off. That's the control he has over me and I have allowed that. I don't work and he says that he has every right to be in the house because he pays the bills. Another control thing, which is the reason I want to see a lawyer...to protect myself as well as the kids. This kills me to do this, but feel he is not giving me much of a choice. How can I love someone like this? we will have been married 19 yrs. in July. I really want to save this marriage but how can that happen with all that's going on? Please help me! Feel very confused and hopeless. Thought that when he moved home, we would be moving forward. Also feel that maybe I'm paranoid and making mountains out of mole hills or am I taking more than I should to get to a place where he is committed to our family? I truly don't understand any of this and his parents are devastated. His dad is the one who recommended a lawyer. Says H needs a rude awakening. I welcome any response.

deb,

I am at work right now honey but I wanted to give ya a hug...

I'll be back in a bit



Le

Have you read Penny's ebook, if you haven't download and read it it'll help..

I'll be back.....

debb...

Before you do or say anything to your H, I think its time to definitely see an atty to find out what your rights are with regards to having him removed, protecting your kids and yourself from his behavior and making sure financially you will be taken care of. And don't squirm away from things that you aren't comfortable with.. like making sure that you will get paid for monthly bills and such from him and the tirade that is sure to come when you tell him.

I don't think its a matter of not loving him or wanting a divorce.. cause it doesn't sound like thats what you want. It's a matter of a "wake up" call.. that he can't have both a family and an OW... marriage just don't work that way.

So, yes.. a reality check is in order. If he can't or won't choose between the two himself, it is you that will force the choice. I'm not sure if you're in a position for no contact as yet.. so lets see what happens with the atty and such before we go further with that.

As for your questions about how can he promise you one thing and do another? Easy. Thats why we call the affair an addiction. Cause people in them usually behave like addicts do. Their decisions, thought processes, core values are all compromised by the self centered "fog".

Keep us posted and we'll be here to help you along as well.

Loui

Thank you for the advice...I am very scared of losing my marriage, but at the same time don't want to live in this unhealthy environment he has put us in. Texted him earlier, if we could meet for dinner since the kids would be out for the evening and he's working late (no surprise, there), but wants to meet when he's done work. He's self employed which makes it very easy for him to say he's got emergency calls. I've been logging this information to check when I do the monthly billing. I shouldn't have to do this, but it seems I have to stay 2 steps ahead...very tiring to say the least. When he was living in the camper, the pattern seemed to be that he couldn't see the kids on that nite because of an "emergency call". How ironic that he "broke it off" with her on a Wed. nite. Know I will have to sniff out the work shirt tomorrow. Can't believe I'm saying this. What a crazy life this has become. Please tell me there's light at the end of this tunnel. I understand I will probably have to go thru some more pain and heart ache...like I haven't had enough already! You always feel like, am I doing the right thing, which is even worse because these decisions ultimately affect the children. I'm trying to hang in there. Thought the worst was over when he decided to move back home. Don't understand why he moved back home...insane.

So.... why did you let him continue to live at home after you found him talking on the phone with his affair partner? I know he wants to fight about that. But really. Sleep with someone else if you want, but you can't then spend time in my house. Simple rule, until you let yourself be convinced by words that aren't supported by action.

I've been there. I know.

Careful with the lawyer. When you start down that route, it's hard to shift from the standard outcome lawyers expect. If you want to start with how you keep your husband out of your house, okay. But really. Make sure you know what you want and then think about the best ways to get it. The attorney might or might not be the best way.

Guess I thought that once he was moved back home, then he would be committed to working on healing our family. This is the first time I have had to deal with this kind of situation and I'm sure I have made alot of poor decisions, but sometimes your heart gets in the way of your brain. I'm seeing an attorney to find out what the laws are regarding this situation. Once I know this, I will have a lot more self confidence than I do now. I have prepared the girls (12 & 17), that I may have to kick him out at which time we can not have any contact until a visitation arrangement can be made. The girls know about the affair, but my 10 yr. old son does not. He will clearly be devastated, but has expressed how he has seen a change in his dad that he doesn't like. He's understandably angry, but he will be the most affected only because he doesn't know how to process this situation. I have asked my father-in-law to go with me to the attorney for support as well as being able to hear what the att. has to say and ask questions that I may not think of. His parents are very angry with him and are just as hurt as we are. I am blessed by his family's support and encouragement. Cheaters don't realize that they hurt more than just the wife and kids, everyone is affected. I may choose to see a different attorney also, but main objective is to know my rights. It's still hard to believe my H is capable of this behavior and everyone was shocked when he left his children. Although he's very controlling, he has always been the best loving father and very attentive to our needs...that is, before the affair...

quote:

You always feel like, am I doing the right thing, which is even worse because these decisions ultimately affect the children.

Hi Debb7. I'm glad you found SYMC. Unfortunately, these situations really affect kids in the worst way. Right now, I am at month 9 after D-day. I have a 7 year old daughter whose life has been blown apart since her dad disclosed that he was having feelings for a co-worker.

Oh my...it's so tough on these children, so don't be surprised to see feelings of abandonment, acting out, depression and even thinking they did something to cause it. Not only from the youngest one, but all three of them. With my child, I had the school psychologist and a therapist see her. It helped immensely. You might want to keep that in mind.

It still shows the affects on my little girl, just about daily in some way. Whether she is telling someone that her dad left us (she did that this morning) to just being sad and depressed...or inconsolable because she wants her daddy home and her life back with her family...and rightly so. No family should ever have to be devestated in this way...

This is, without a doubt the most difficult thing I've ever had to do in my life and I equate it to a horrible nightmare. But, with the help of people here, I have been able to get through one day at a time. Baby steps. Trying to get to a place of healing for me and my child. This is what you will have to do as well. First off though, you need to take care of yourself and your children. No matter what you say or do, your H won't notice. He can't. I still find that hard to deal with, but trust me...nothing you say or do will phase him in a good way.

I do understand oh so well when you said:

quote:

he has always been the best loving father and very attentive to our needs

I still find it amazing that a man lived here who said he loved his wife and child more than anything and then was able to walk away from us. I've said it before and I'll say it again...last year at this time, if anyone had said, your husband will tell you he's involved with someone at work, I would have quite frankly told them they were insane. But it happened and my head still spins from it.

We have a good thread on here under Daily Grind that will give you some tips on taking care of YOU! You are embarking on the hardest thing you will ever do in your life and that is pull yourself up from your grief and hurt and confusion and feelings of betrayal, to take care of yourself and your kids. So that you will be strong for whatever it is you choose to do. Either hang in there and stay strong on your end of the marriage and try and work through it, or move forward in another direction.

Everyone on this forum has been where you are, or are there right now (me) or has been on the flip side in the role of OW or OM. We all work together in this wonderful, kind, compassionate place to support each other.

I have to say that I agree with Just J about the attorney. Be very, very careful and make sure that you have chosen one who will help you explore what your rights are, but will not pressure you into a divorce, one that is pro marriage, should that be the path you want to take.

quote:

I am very scared of losing my marriage, but at the same time don't want to live in this unhealthy environment he has put us in.

I hear you sweetie..and I know exactly how you feel.

Sending big hugs to you and the kids.

quote:

but sometimes your heart gets in the way of your brain

You know, I think that's the big part of the battle that we all have in common!
Good luck with everything. Remember we are here if you want to vent, ask stuff, sook, whatever. And well done confronting the hard decisions (seeing a lawyer, figuring out whether to kick him out, etc.). It's painful stuff - sometimes it's so much easier to avoid and hope - but not done it just prolongs things. Make sure to look after yourself through this.

Actually.. at the moment.. you are trying to control a situation in which you have no control of. The "keeping 2 steps ahead" thought process is exactly what thats all about.

So.. when you go to the attorney, make it perfectly clear that you do NOT want a divorce. That you do NOT want to go down that route. All you want to know are what your rights are in the matter of having him removed from the house until the affair is over and during that time making sure that your financial things are handled. (what exactly is his responsibility in such a situation and what exactly can you expect in that dept)

Now.. here's some things that you can do actually..

You can tell your H that you will no longer tolerate this behavior from him. Either he decides to end the affair or move out.

And tell him that in order to believe that the affair is over and for him to remain in the house he has to:

1. Give up the cell phone and the cell phone number.
2. Let you see ALL his emails and all his accounts, on a regular basis..
3. Report where he is and who he is with at regular intervals
4. No more.. "emergency" last minute have to "work late" stuff for awhile.
5. Continued marriage counseling..
6. And the toughest one.. he has to send a N/C letter to the OW that BOTH of you sign.

And btw, I know you asked for some of these things before, but you let him get away with alot without enforcing your boundaries. Such as the excuses about the working late, the hiding the phone, etc. All of that is fini, done.. and YOU have to see it being done. If he is not willing to do ALL of those things (and a few more besides).. then you will need to go forward with moving him out and possibly a full Protection Phase and N/C..

It may be a good idea for you to read about Protection Phase and that sort of thing as well.

Loui

quote:

And btw, I know you asked for some of these things before, but you let him get away with alot without enforcing your boundaries. Such as the excuses about the working late, the hiding the phone, etc. All of that is fini, done.. and YOU have to see it being done. If he is not willing to do ALL of those things (and a few more besides).. then you will need to go forward with moving him out and possibly a full Protection Phase and N/C..

Loui is right on here Debb7. It's hard...so HARD, but you can't live the way you are living now. I made sure my NC letter allowed my husband to understand that I married him for life and that I would be more then willing to talk about working on our marriage once he ENDS the affair. However, I could no longer live with him in the house (catching him texting this AP etc and knowing that when my back was turned, he was in contact with her) I felt like he was just here doing his "duty" until the minute he could get out and do as he pleased with this AP. I was very close to hating him actually and even more closer to a full blown nervous breakdown on my part. NC allowed me to step back and heal and help DD7 heal. Do I still have moments of depression, hurt etc? Yes I do, this is a trauma not only our hearts and souls, but many other levels as well. However, if I had not done what I did...would we be divorced right now? HIGHLY likely.

So when you get time, read, read, read on here if you are up to it. Check out all the links etc and read up on No Contact.

Wishing you and the kids all the best. Hang in there. I know it's hard to believe right now, but it does get a bit easier over time.

I am very embarrassed to say...the "perfume" on his shirt turned out to be deoderant. when I opened his cabinet I immediately smelled the "perfume" and then found the smell to be his deoderant. I feel so paranoid all the time. Even my oldest daughter said she feels like I'm looking for something to be suspicious of. I'm thinking she's right...how do you learn how to trust until he gives you a reason not to trust. It's very frustrating and at times I feel I will go absolutely crazy. HELP!

quote:

I feel so paranoid all the time

I think this is perfectly normal, until the time comes that he gives you reason to NOT be paranoid.

I wish there was more I could say to help you Debb7...But I'm pretty much in the same boat you are. I have a H...but he doesn't seem to want to see too much of what he's done around here to his family. Until that day comes, I just have to concentrate on DD7 and myself.

And your oldest daughter, I can understand why she would think what she said, that you are looking for things to be suspicious of, but unless someone has lived this nightmare, they simply can not understand why you would feel the way you do. Kids don't understand the affects infidelity has on a wife or husband.

It's the ultimate betrayal and words can't describe it. And it will have an affect on the kids as well. 17 is one of those ages where they will teeter totter back and forth, because their own emotions are in turmoil, so don't feel bad over anything DD17 might say. She saw her dad make the move to come home. To her that might be enough...but for you, there has to be accountability and in my opinion, that's not too much to ask for.

Have you read anything that Penny has put out here or have you tried to contact her? I would highly suggest you try to get in touch with her. She will explain things to you with such clarity...she knows her stuff.

Hang in there, the weekends are quiet around here and I'm sure someone will give you more words of wisdom then I can right now. All I can say is, I know exactly how you feel..

Debb - I'm so relieved for you that it was his deodorant! I'm so glad.
As for trust - I don't know if you can rebuild that if he's still not being transparent. Even with him being transparent, it takes time, and takes work from you and him. But without? I'm not sure if there's much work you can do towards trusting him if he won't play too...

Hi Debb - welcome to SYMC. Really sorry you have to be dealing with this. There are few things as awful. If you don't already have my eBook I think you would find it very helpful. The link to order it is in my sig line. It's $16 ... and if that is a problem in any way email me (link also in sig line) and I will send it to you free.

ALL of us make mistakes when we're faced with this stuff. We're hardwired to trust those close to us and have no roadmap for what to do when that trust in betrayed.... especially when it 's betrayed in this kind of situation.

It is time, though, for you to take a breath, decide what it is YOU want, and to set some very firm boundaries backed up by action. If you don't do that you will become the greatest danger to your marriage.

Here are some questions you may have already answered (and I apologize if I missed them)

Who is this woman? (co-worker, friend....?)
Is she married?
Have you contacted her H?
Have you confronted her about the affair?
Have you told friends and family and asked for their active support for your marriage?

These are all things that I strongly reccomned you do. Several of us are not around this week due to a SYMC family wedding so I apologize if we seem a bit distracted or absent. Please do order my eBook - it discusses all those things and much more. And, really really, if the cost is a problem email me and I will send it to you.

Hugs,

P