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The Village at SYMC
The Village at SYMC
Infidelity
Another very public affair story|
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Village Elder Moderator |
__________________________ Heaven bend to take my hand, And lead me through the fire Be the long awaited answer, to a long and painful fight. Truth be told I tried my best, but somewhere along the way, I got caught up in all there was to offer. And the cost was so much more than I could bear. - Sarah McLachlan |
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Village Elder Moderator |
I'm continually amazed at how many US Congressmen with Presidential hopes - play with the infidelity fire. Which supports how strong the pull is to affairs. You are willing to risk everything.
And this particular man seemed so meshed in his strong religious beliefs....so strong in his condemnation of other political figures who stumbled....and he even belonged to a male evangelical group promoting fidelity. It's like he betrayed is wife and the very core of his beliefs (or at least the beliefs he professed to the public), and he was willing to risk EVERYTHING for the affair. Amazing. Hmmm...anyone believe the story that he was already separated from his wife when the A began? __________________________ Heaven bend to take my hand, And lead me through the fire Be the long awaited answer, to a long and painful fight. Truth be told I tried my best, but somewhere along the way, I got caught up in all there was to offer. And the cost was so much more than I could bear. - Sarah McLachlan |
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SYMC Founder Coach |
I'm more surprised that there aren't stories like this about virtually all of them. I suspect it's far more common than even the high profile cases make it appear. Someone on MB, years ago, posted an article or some research about the higher incidence of affairs among men in positions of power. It's tied to the sense of entitlement that comes with wealth and power. I wanna say it was johnh3439 (or whatever the numbers were!) but I could be wrong about that.
I'm not surprised either that he was known for his strong religious views. Those who protest the loudest and all that .... What I find so hard to fathom is the idea that being honest, ending the affair, working to heal his marriage, apparently apologize to the AP's spouse AND to come forward voluntarily will likely spell the end of his political hopes. But those in the know will look the other way as long as you don't get caught. Bizarre. Not that I think what he did is ok - but maybe if we focused on how people like this handle it afterward there would be more marriages repaired and more role models to lead the way back to integrity. P ~ * ~ * ~ * ~ * ~ * ~ * ~ * ~ penny.tupy@yahoo.com My eBook – Overcoming Infidelity One on one personalized help – Hire me “I don’t love you anymore. I’m not sure I ever did. I’m moving out. The kids will understand. They’ll want me to be happy.” “It’s not age-appropriate to expect children to be concerned with their parents’ happiness. Not unless you want to create co-dependents who’ll spend their lives in bad relationships and therapy." ~*~ Laura A. Munson “Heroes know that things must happen when it is time for them to happen. A quest may not simply be abandoned; unicorns may go unrescued for a long time, but not forever; a happy ending cannot come in the middle of the story.” ~*~Peter S. Beagle~*~ |
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Village Elder |
I don't know. It doesn't shock me at all that those with strong religious beliefs against infidelity commit infidelity. I think most people who have affairs believed in their core that they would never do that, then do it.
I believe only teeny tiny fraction of people believe themselves capable of an affair - until they are boiling in it, then it is typically justified away as we have all heard more than once! And I believe that justification is because of that personal belief in themselves that they wouldn't have an affair. Have to make it line up somehow with their original belief about themselves.
No. He's justifying.
I think I remember that article and it is the power. Very interesting.
You know, the part about dashing presidential hopes makes sense to me. Even though a person may do all the right things and make amends - well that is easy to see when you are close to that person - the spouse, child, friend etc. That builds trust within that relationship. It is much harder, as a remove public, to truely believe what they say but you can't really see what they really do. And we always say believe their actions not neccesarily their words. I think it would take probably years for a public to really believe that they are trustworthy partly because of the reputation politicians have of bending the truth to their liking even without an affair. And partly because it would take on a whole different level of trust-building with the public that seems rather impossible in the political arena anyway. Add an affair and it seems they are untrustworthy at what most would assume is their most important relationship. Why would they be trustworthy to complete strangers? Not that I neccesarily agree with that rationale but I do understand it. And I say all that and then the Kennedys come to mind. ~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~ Your life is an occasion, rise to it. Mr Magorium |
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Village Elder |
PS - And for some reason the word POLITICO really cracked me up. What a name!!!
~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~ Your life is an occasion, rise to it. Mr Magorium |
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Villager |
I was reading one of the articles on the site you posted that had the Stosny article Penny (man it was like a labyrinth - every article I read had another 5 tantalising links on the side!). It was talking about the polygnous history/origins of humans and how it was the wealthy and powerful in such a society that had access to the multiple wives. It pointed out that a similar effect operates today - less openly - in terms of infidelity or the serial monogamy whereby powerful men marry women for the duration of their childbearing years and then trade in for a younger model (effectively still depriving lower status men of a childbearing partner - without the burden of having to keep them after they age!). I'm paraphrasing, but it was interesting (and depressing?) food for thought.
Yes this struck me too - especially reading the bit about the affair starting after they separated... which I took at face value when I read it! Perhaps I'm gullible. But it seemed so much lesser than all the undercover and "I did not have sexual relations with that woman" stuff that goes on without any real consequence.
That's spot on Tiggy. Yet I didn't think of it till you said it. It's like we see people who espouse these values as being strong in them - and everybody else as if they just waft about without any particular values. But mostly they DO have them. The pull is just that strong. Knowing that, I wonder why we (I?) still have that perception. |
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Villager |
Sometimes I don't think it has anything to do with wealth or power. I just have a feeling that there are some in the world who think they are entitled for whatever reason. Be it the way they were brought up or how their brain fires or yes, wealth and power. And it is so sad. I read this article yesterday and I hope for the sake of his family that he and his wife work it out. Sandy |
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Villager |
I think there are some of these - I've met one - the type who seek out multiple affairs with full intention beforehand, and aren't sorry after (except about being caught). Doesn't sound like that sort of scenario though.
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Founding Member / Pioneer Villager Adjunct Coach Village Butterfly |
I would rather have someone who has made mistakes, learned from them, and become a man of higher integrity, compassion, and honesty -- by learning the depths of his own humanity -- as President than any innocent.
In many ways, it's similar to how the greatest pacifists are the people who have actually seen war -- and learned to hate it on personal, up-close terms. I would hate to have an innocent in the White House. Imagine the dreadful mistakes that would happen then. But then, perhaps we have had all too many innocents already. And of course, when it's someone who is not an innocent, you don't always know exactly what they've learned. Some learn to love war, as well as those who learn to hate it. --------------------------------------- Oh love Oh love Oh the many colors that you're made of You heal You bleed You're the simple truth And you're the biggest mystery Oh love Oh love http://www.symcinc.com/about/compassion.html |
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Village Elder |
Certainly and good point. The problem still is how they prove that they have learned from their mistakes, and reached for higher levels of integrity, compassion and honesty. That is far easier to accomplish within one relationship with your spouse. I believe it would far more difficult to accomplish with the public at large. Not sure what exactly you mean when you say "innocent". HOwever, if I understand you right, I do think it takes far more than to have made bad choices and corrected them to be a good leader! Also, I think I disagree that someone who is an innocent (i.e. someone who hasn't made wrong choices, and who hasn't?) isn't capable of being a strong ethical leader. I do agree that suffering a tragedy or loss can give a person depth and understanding. All that said and I am not even sure it continues to *really* matter what a person's sexual moral history is when trying to become president. I mean we reelect representative all the time that have made some iffy or even blatant bad choices. ~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~ Your life is an occasion, rise to it. Mr Magorium |
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Villager |
I think in this context an 'innocent' would be someone who hasn't been tested.
Too often I hear people make broad brush statements about the actions of others without ever having been in their shoes. Like my innocent little friend in 1st year uni who told us all how she would like to meet a guy and 'be friends, maybe hold hands' for about 3 years and then get married - anything else was a bit lacking in class/self restraint. Within 6 months she was making out with him in the glass doored common room of... wait for it... our Opus Dei nun-run college! Or the way I dragged H over the coals for his flirtation when we were going out. It was so obvious to me how wrong it was I had no empathy or insight whatsoever. I think that sort of innocence is different from the ones who have been tested, but made the right choices. Although I suppose one could argue that maybe they just hadn't been tested as savagely as somebody else. Who knows. I know people can go their whole lives without being tested on a number of assumptions. I think being tested... and not running away or justifying the result, but facing and learning from it, grows a person. It seems like Ensign is one of those who formed and publicised his views when he had not yet been tested - and then he was. I do often wonder about the relevance of sexual or other history in jobs that don't relate to it. On the one hand it makes sense that a person's principles and actions and thoughts are indicative of who they are. On the other hand I could hire someone who is an excellent bricklayer but a ruthless philanderer. Not all personality factors affect ability to conduct all jobs. I guess it depends on what the primary skills are required for which jobs. I wonder to what extent sexual fidelity relates to anything a politician does. Arguably a recurrently successful philanderer would be a great hire for cigarette marketing - great promotional skills and not too fussy about honesty? |
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Village Elder Moderator |
Sounds John Ensign is at the beginning stages of the learning curve of becoming enlightened. I think for the past year he's been scrambling to keep this whole affair quiet and finally came out publically when the story was about to hit the newspapers anyway.
This message has been edited. Last edited by: GS_SYMC, __________________________ Heaven bend to take my hand, And lead me through the fire Be the long awaited answer, to a long and painful fight. Truth be told I tried my best, but somewhere along the way, I got caught up in all there was to offer. And the cost was so much more than I could bear. - Sarah McLachlan |
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Village Elder Moderator |
"Would you believe I was separated from my wife when I was dating her? She was separated too!" Ummm...missed it by THAT much. __________________________ Heaven bend to take my hand, And lead me through the fire Be the long awaited answer, to a long and painful fight. Truth be told I tried my best, but somewhere along the way, I got caught up in all there was to offer. And the cost was so much more than I could bear. - Sarah McLachlan |
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Villager |
Wow everybody concerned sounds dodgy as hell.
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Village Elder |
Oh my gosh! I think I actually heard Maxwell Smart when I read that GS!!! ~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~ Your life is an occasion, rise to it. Mr Magorium |
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SYMC Founder Coach |
Yanno - Bill Harley always said to "put it on the evening news," in regard to exposure. I'm just not sure it doesn't make the BP look a wee bit insane. 'Specially since the affair was already over. Fascinating to watch though! What I really wanna know is why the senator's career is ruined and Angelina Jolie's is stronger than ever? P ~ * ~ * ~ * ~ * ~ * ~ * ~ * ~ penny.tupy@yahoo.com My eBook – Overcoming Infidelity One on one personalized help – Hire me “I don’t love you anymore. I’m not sure I ever did. I’m moving out. The kids will understand. They’ll want me to be happy.” “It’s not age-appropriate to expect children to be concerned with their parents’ happiness. Not unless you want to create co-dependents who’ll spend their lives in bad relationships and therapy." ~*~ Laura A. Munson “Heroes know that things must happen when it is time for them to happen. A quest may not simply be abandoned; unicorns may go unrescued for a long time, but not forever; a happy ending cannot come in the middle of the story.” ~*~Peter S. Beagle~*~ |
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Village Elder |
Now isn't that the truth! And after all my little *arguements* I really wonder if it will matter in the long run. We in Oregon had good old Bob Packwood long after the years and years of sexual harassment he had committed. Besides some of my favorite people have had affairs. Of course they have become super-heros with a big fidelity written on thier cape. (So where's the superhero graemlin when you need one!?
I have never quite understood the concept of exposure. With my first husband, it seemed like everyone knew about his affair and all it seemed to do is isolate me and my children. People were, of course, not in favour of the affair but didn't have a clue how they were supposed to react, so they just stayed away saying it was none of their business. My husband now, I made it extremely clear that I didn't want the world to know. He did however, end the affair immediately, so maybe I would have chosen something different if he hadn't. I don't know. ~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~ Your life is an occasion, rise to it. Mr Magorium |
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Villager |
Worse, I think it can make the BS out 2 seem overly vindictive and the WS overly villanous. I exposed way back in the olden days, 2 family and a few close friends based on MB recommendations. Did absolutely no good at all. In fact, it only alienated my W's best friend when she chose 2 expose 2 their employer (my W had hired OM as a consultant, and that's why her friend informed the company). My W hasn't spoken 2 her since, and that was almost 6 years ago now. -ol' 2long "Light travels faster than sound. That's why some people appear bright until you hear them speak." -Unknown |
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SYMC Founder Coach |
Agree and agree.
I think, like just about anything else, it's essential to use discernment and to act from a place of reasoned groundedness. As I've said for more years than I care to think about - you can't legislate either intelligent or ethical behavior. There are times when I think exposure is absolutely the correct choice. And times when it is utterly harmful. This is where all the work on values and compassion becomes central to the process. And it helps to have someone knowledgeable about the bigger picture to bounce things off of as well. P ~ * ~ * ~ * ~ * ~ * ~ * ~ * ~ penny.tupy@yahoo.com My eBook – Overcoming Infidelity One on one personalized help – Hire me “I don’t love you anymore. I’m not sure I ever did. I’m moving out. The kids will understand. They’ll want me to be happy.” “It’s not age-appropriate to expect children to be concerned with their parents’ happiness. Not unless you want to create co-dependents who’ll spend their lives in bad relationships and therapy." ~*~ Laura A. Munson “Heroes know that things must happen when it is time for them to happen. A quest may not simply be abandoned; unicorns may go unrescued for a long time, but not forever; a happy ending cannot come in the middle of the story.” ~*~Peter S. Beagle~*~ |
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The Village at SYMC
The Village at SYMC
Infidelity
Another very public affair story
