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The Village at SYMC The Village at SYMC Infidelity Emotional Abuse (Overcoming Victim Identity) by S. Stosny|
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Village Elder |
Overcoming Victim Identity from Steven Stosny's blog
I hope this is helpful to some here. This link and the text below is from a recent entry from Steven Stosny's blog, "Anger in the Age of Entitlement." I'm not sure about copyright laws, but I'm hoping by linking and acknowledging who wrote this, it's OK to paste it here.
"If it's not fun, tell me, why are you still playing?" |
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SYMC Founder Coach |
I love Stosny's work. (I need to remember to add a link to his blog (where this came from) to the newsletter!)
This not being a victim thing is dang hard work. So much easier to hand over responsibility for our feelings - and therefore our healing - than to do the work. Or so it seems, I guess, until we really look at the alternative -- being stuck and waiting on someone else before we believe we can heal. Good stuff for the holiday season! P ~ * ~ * ~ * ~ * ~ * ~ * ~ * ~ penny.tupy@yahoo.com My eBook – Overcoming Infidelity One on one personalized help – Hire me “I don’t love you anymore. I’m not sure I ever did. I’m moving out. The kids will understand. They’ll want me to be happy.” “It’s not age-appropriate to expect children to be concerned with their parents’ happiness. Not unless you want to create co-dependents who’ll spend their lives in bad relationships and therapy." ~*~ Laura A. Munson “Heroes know that things must happen when it is time for them to happen. A quest may not simply be abandoned; unicorns may go unrescued for a long time, but not forever; a happy ending cannot come in the middle of the story.” ~*~Peter S. Beagle~*~ |
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SYMC/Mod |
I don't want to speak for anyone else, but I not only too responsibility for how others treated me, but I used how they treated me as a measure of my self worth ~ which is possibly inherent in the above quote anyway, but I felt compelled to add on this distinction since it took me until just recently to realize it. I am not just responsible for the way I treat people, I am responsible for the way I treat MYSELF. This is far from entitlement. I am talking about treating myself with the kindness and respect that I treat those around me with. Giving myself the benefit of the doubt, choosing to focus on my strengths and being gentle with myself regarding my weaknesses. Self Care. Slowly but surely, I have attracted like-minded people to me. They reflect back my strengths to me so I can see them more clearly, and they are gentle with me.  Thanks for posting this, Lily! Spidey Do not let my fear-based reaction, be your sign from the Universe! |
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SYMC Head Moderator Board of Advisors |
Absolutely true!!
And the amazing thing is the journey... when the little lightbulbs begin to click.. and you turn around to see where you were and where you are as you do your work. It is a spectacular and fulfilling reward. And you definitely realize afterwards that you 'don't have to take it anymore' is not just a truth, it's a mantra. Loui  "Everything's changed in a matter of minutes, nothing was saved in time. All of my old world and everything in it is hard to find, but they never...never were mine" "Before you knew me, an Angel came to me. I wrestled him down to the ground. He said he could cure me I said that don't worry me now." |
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Village Elder |
Good article Lily!
 Penny, Spidey, and Loui!My XH called me about a month ago. He was admitted to the hospital for an elective surgery and ended up in ICU for 2 weeks. He called me because after his brush with death, he wanted me to go with him to see his dad, from whom he's been estranged for years (his dad is also estranged from almost everyone, even closer to death, but doesn't want to see XH). He's been calling ever since, even getting kind of belligerent when I don't respond. I can feel my defensive mind racing to find the "right" words that won't escalate the situation... the abusive cycle flaring up. Then he apologizes, telling me he loves me and has always loved me, and we're off and running... still, 8 years since d'day with 6 years of NC (except for divorce related stuff). I guess it's like riding a bicycle, you never forget how to play the game. Coincidentally, I needed him to sign some papers so I did see him. He looked terrible and gave no indication that he's stopped drinking. Interaction with him brings up feelings I thought were dead. I wanted him back so badly once, to get sober again and keep our family together. Contact with him struck that nerve, revived that hope. Maintaining some kind of R with him sounded like a good thing, at least an opportunity to work through lingering feelings... but now it feels like trying to revive the dead cat ~ or the dead child ~ in "Pet Sematary"...difficult to let go of, but better left dead. And like the undead in Pet Sematary, what's left reminds me of him, of what we had, but it isn't. He's changed. I've changed. The family we had is gone forever ~ some dead, others permanently alienated. It probably doesn't help that this is happening around the holidays, which are like a mass cultural bout of PMS, heightening emotions for everyone at once. I haven't responded to his last apology and haven't decided yet if I will. I still have the feeling of obligation, especially when he's being reasonable and apologetic, and the need to explain myself, though now it's also to assert myself. And, I also feel sorry for him. |
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SYMC/Mod |
LUCKY!!! I have missed you! So happy to 'see' you here!!!!
      
Get out of my head!!! Exactly why I no longer have any kind of contact with X - except you said it in about 500 less words than I would have, and much more eloquently. Per usual. ;-)
Yeah. The last time X invited me over for dinner, I didn't have the...whatever it was I was looking for...to say "No" flat-out ~ I ended up doing homework, missed his call to bring something over, and then no-showed on him. Since then, I have received no more invitations thankfully. Obligation vs. my need to assert myself and protect myself. I don't think I feel sorry for X yet, though. I don't know if I ever will. Well, I do when I know him and CW are actively going through one of their cycles, because I know intuitively that while they are still entwined with each other neither will be able to move on. And I don't think their relationship will be viable long-term. BUT, that is 1)neither here nor there, and 2)none of my business. But in that sense, yes, I do feel sorry for him. But all of his other bad luck and such, I just look at as karma ~ the one thing you cannot ever escape are the natural consequences for your actions. For that I have no pity for him. I have no pity for myself, either (except on the days that I do!!! ha ha) with the lessons I need to learn. They will keep coming at me in different shapes and forms I'm sure until I finally 'get' them. I am grateful for this, because often I have a thick head and need something to come at me more than one or two or three times before I snap out of it. *sigh* So glad you stopped in. Do it more often. You always have the BESTEST words/thoughts/expressions. |
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Village Elder |
So glad you stopped in. Do it more often. You always have the BESTEST words/thoughts/expressions.
Thanks Spidey. I think that's an example of the aphorism, "absence makes the heart grow fonder."  I did reply to XH, basically saying some of his words were an unpleasant flashback from the past, even friendship would require rebuilding bridges he destroyed, and I'm not sure I have the energy for that. I haven't heard back since, and don't really expect to. The dream of reconciling and living "happily ever after" sustained me for years ~ the soulmate R and happy family (that no longer exists because all it's members are either dead, dying, engrossed in their addictions, and/or not speaking to each other) living a life that triumphed against all odds. I'd already mostly let it go, having tried to fill the hole with things that didn't work ~ other R's, another business venture thaat failed and destroyed a friendship in the process, a new house ~ and I'm still feeling me way toward happiness, serenity, fulfillment. Ironically, we were together in holding on to that dream even while apart, and sadly that's not enough to make it real. I pity XH if he's only just realizing the emptiness of that dream. The resentment and self-righteousness that came up in response to his prying questions and guilt trips when I didn't respond the way he wanted made me realize what hard work goes into restoring M's after a crisis such as an A. I used to envy those members of this community who have saved their M's, but now I have nothing but admiration for them. |
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Villager |
Ladies, your responses sound to me like grief. How long does it take to work through all the way to an acceptance that lasts?
I've been divorced a month, will this go on for years? Back to the article...what struck me was the line about how much the abuser hurts himself when he abuses the partner. Is it the other way around too? I mean when I can't, won't, let go of that need to punish XW, do I hurt myself? If so, then I'm toast unless I figure out how to let go of that. Now I don't mean punish in the sense of any outward actions. It's more like...let me give you an example. I was at the grocery at midnight the other night. Rounding the corner who do I nearly collide with? XW. It was over in an instant. I chuckled, like "what are the odds...". She smiled and waved. We said nothing and I quickly turned and went on. And I was mad at myself. I smiled and chuckled. Why wasn't my reflex to narrow my eyes and frown? Dang it. Why was she beautiful instead of repulsive? It bugged me all night. I realized that for an instant I forgot everything she'd done to me, forgot who she really is. I'd let down my guard and wasn't prepared to punish her. I smiled for heaven's sake! This compassion, for her, for myself, it confuses me. How do I let it go now that I've taken it as far as it can go-divorce? Because frankly divorce isn't bad enough for her. It's all I can do but it's not enough. I don't want her to thrive, I don't want her to get on with life like I am. I want her consequences to be bad, really bad. Why? So let's say I let go of that. Let's say we meet in the grocery and I treat her like any stranger. Let's say I let go of all of my stuff above, because it just hurts me to hold onto it. What is that? Forgiveness? Compassion? Weakness? |
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Founding Member / Pioneer Villager Adjunct Coach Village Butterfly |
Some of it isn't grief, I think, when we're healing from abusive or addictive relationships. Some is, well, healing. The kind of healing you have to do when your body and your psyche have been subjected to tremendous injury/trauma. Still, you're right that grief is a large component of the larger whole. As for how long it lasts? I'd say that the worst of it took six months, and then there was a longer period that lasted until almost exactly two years later. I mark the end of that second time frame by the date when I could finally think again. Before that, my mental faculties were at maybe 80%, which was a significant problem. After that, there were days when I was terribly sad about what had happened, or angry, or whatever, but it wasn't a constant thing. The waves of emotion have gotten steadily less intense and steadily less frequent. There are still times when I miss my family-that-was, though, and I suspect there always will be.
You know... what you forgot was how angry you are at her. And the way you reacted was the way you might have reacted to any other person who you nearly ran into at the grocery store. With the added affection of it being someone you've known for a very long time. That's not a bad thing, actually. In that moment of chuckling, I think, is the emotion that will actually be the healthiest in the long run. When you can chuckle -- and then -not- beat yourself up for it, but just smile and walk away still cheerful, that'll be really good. --------------------------------------- Oh love Oh love Oh the many colors that you're made of You heal You bleed You're the simple truth And you're the biggest mystery Oh love Oh love http://www.symcinc.com/about/compassion.html |
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SYMC/Mod |
I agree with J. For an instant, you forgot everything she'd done, and you Remembered who she really is. She is more than the sum of her poor behaviors. We all are, thank goodness. Yes, it is grief for me - mingled with what J said, healing. I am on the tail end of my grief, the sadness. I am past the anger and the denial. Sometimes, I am caught off guard by a wave of grief about how much we both lost in the way everything went down. I lost my best friend, that I've been with since I was 16. To answer your other questions, I have found that the more I heal, the more I wish him to be happy and move on and have a good life. I used to be in such a rush to move on first and have a good life first. I kept thinking that was "out there" for me to find. I was rather frantic about the whole thing, actually. But now I realize that my best life is inside of me, not "out there" somewhere. I am now OK with whatever opinion or judgment he has of me. Because I know who I am and what I'm doing. I am mourning the loss of the most significant relationship of my life. I loved him deeply and completely and I divorced him. Of course I am going to have natural consequences for that. Interesting about your time frame, J. I am coming up in February on my 2-year divorce date. At least this year should be better than last! Holy Duke. :-) |
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SYMC/Mod |
Get out of my head!!! Seriously, it's getting creepy.
I have mixed feelings about this. I feel that I did try to save my marriage the first time, but that X didn't. He still wanted to hold onto his excuses for what he'd done, his reasons. And I allowed it. I still envy those couples who are BOTH on board and try hard. I have no delusions about how hard it is, but I was dragging a dead horse behind me the whole time, and now I have a bad taste in my mouth because of it. I wonder if I will ever believe in anyone or anything enough again to put myself out there like that. Because after re-investing in someone, and they do it again ~ well, it almost crushed me. Broke something inside of me that I don't know will ever be repaired. Time will tell. |
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Villager |
How lovely that Gregory can greet his x with a chuckle and a joly remark. What a great response. I would love to move away from the anger and the hurt and the downright jealousy that the thought of seeing my x inspires.
Meanwhile, I would like some advice. My x and I are only communicating about the divorce and the house sale, but on Tuesday it is the 8th anniversary of our son's death. What should I do/say? As I write this it seems obvious that I should just send him a caring message, but I have got so defensive. He NEVER contacts me and I feel as though each time I contact him (say, twice in the last 4 months and these are only for house related reasons), I am giving away something of myself. What is that about? Any ideas for how I detach myself from the pain of his rejection, so that I can be a loving co-parent making a connect at a time when we will both be thinking about our mutual loss? Our greatest glory is not in never falling but in rising every time we fall |
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Village Elder Moderator |
I'm sorry for the loss of your son Jules.  I have never lost a child, so forgive my perspective if it's naive. I wonder though, what YOU need at this painful anniversary - that may not include your H. I get a sense that H may not be capable of giving you what you may envision to be a caring response. So....what can you do, on your own, that commemorates your son's life and what he meant to you. Perhaps you can involve your other children, other family, caring friends? The other alternative is to send your H something that YOU feel you need to send, without expecting a response. Perhaps write down what you want to say, send it off....and feel the power of being the better person without waiting for a response. Be careful with your feelings during the month hon. It's a very, very hard time for you and I would take on only as much as you feel you can. And I hope if you need to be talking to a professional, that you are. You have a lot on your plate. As this holiday approaches, I'm missing my mom who died earlier this year. It's my first holiday without her. For Thanksgiving my family and and I went to a friend's instead of our normal celebration traditions. It just....seemed like a good year to shake it up and do something different. A time to start new traditions without always comparing it to the old. I look ahead this year, despite the almost overwhelming desire to look back. I hope the same for you. GS __________________________ Heaven bend to take my hand, And lead me through the fire Be the long awaited answer, to a long and painful fight. Truth be told I tried my best, but somewhere along the way, I got caught up in all there was to offer. And the cost was so much more than I could bear. - Sarah McLachlan |
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Village Elder |
jules, I agree with GS. Do whatever feels right to you, but only send something to your x if you can do it without expectation of a response. My XH and I lost his son 4 years ago so I have some ability to empathize. XH has never been part of the experience for me from the initial response through anniversary of DSS's birth and death.
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Villager |
to you Jules for your anniversary. and to you, GS for your mum. Oh Jules, I like GS's idea of sending what you need to send that you won't need a response to. Look after your self at this time, after his rejections you don't need to feel obliged to write to him, but you could also probably take a break from being obliged not to. Just do what you feel you need to do that won't expose you to further hurt, and treat yourself gently, and organise whatever else will help you at this time. |
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Village Elder |
spidey, I understand the bitter taste. I, too, tried to drag my XH back into the M, with the help of 3 different MC's starting with Steve Harley. I, too, hate that feeling of being broken inside. I went hiking today with a couple of guy friends who I hadn't seen in a while and ended up dumping a lot of my resentment about the former friend and former business partner who burned me badly this past summer (one dated her several years ago and one is her good friend). It didn't make me feel better about either myself or the situation!
While I was hiking, I got another text from XH. He asked for my e-mail and when I got home, I found the following e-mail (from his GF's e-mail address): It’s really dark and cold in here. My heart feels atrophied. I no longer trust anyone including myself. I can’t believe I let you go. I can’t believe things between us got so bad. Sometimes I wake up and wonder why you seem so far away but within seconds I remember. I pushed you away, and, in so doing, I lost something precious and unobtainable, something I suspect I’ll never have again. Words cannot even begin to express the sorrow and regret I feel when I think on the demise of our relationship, but I have to try somehow to let you know how I honestly feel about things. I’m not asking you to come back. I wouldn’t wish that kind of chaos on either one of us. But, I do want you to know that I realize what a horrible, unforgivable mistake I’ve made. I want you to know that not a day goes by where I don’t realize how empty my life is without you. It’s important to me that you know this, and it's important to me that you know I remember. I remember falling in love with you. I remember the first time we hugged. I remember our first kiss in the parking lot at xxxxx. I remember the first time that we made love and............. We laughed so loud your roomate was furious. I remember painting our front porch on xxxxx Street red and making breakfast on our antique O’Keefe and Merritt stove. I remember going on monster hunt’s with DSS and marveling at what a naturally great Mother you were. I remember you saving my life by suggesting I may be an alcoholic. I remember xxxxx. All of those late-night promises are now little more than smoke and dust. I remember loving the way you laughed, the way you cried, the way you played, and the way you loved me. I remember all of it, the good and the bad. But surprisingly I mostly remember the good. I suppose separating was for the best. I imagine the fighting would have just continued to escalate. I guess things got to the point where nothing could be salvaged. Or maybe that’s just what I tell myself to try and make some sense of this terrible thing that I've done. I’ve lost a lot of people, but the emptiness that I experience on a fairly continual basis from your absence in my life is by far the most devastating. I can’t have you back, but I wanted you to know that after almost eight years, the pain has not lessened. It’s worse. It’s not as sharp as it once was, but it still aches. Sometimes it still feels like I can’t catch my breath. I wonder, when I am finally able to move forward, if I’ll have learned something about myself. I wonder if I’ll again find it necessary to squander and destroy a love like we once had. I’m afraid that it might be too late, however. I’m afraid that I won’t learn or change or grow. I’m afraid I’m doomed to make the same mistakes over and over again. But, I have some hope. I actually have hope for a lot of things. I hope you have found yourself again after all I put you through. I hope that you laugh a lot and that you are happy most of the time. I hope that you are healthy and well and filled with an inner peace and a sense of self-assuredness. I hope that you finally know love that doesn’t stifle and suffocate. I hope you know that you are an intelligent, inspiring, honest and wonderful woman. And, I hope all your dogs and cats and horses are well and that they continue to bring you joy. I apologize if this letter brings you grief or sadness. That is not my intention. I only wanted you to know that I finally realized what I did to you. I never meant to crush you and put you down and make you feel untrustworthy. I realize that in my insecurity and fear I tried to control and own you. I finally have some understanding of what I did to you, and for that I'm deeply sorry. I will always love you. |
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SYMC/Mod |
Whoa. That is pretty heavy-duty.
How are you feeling about all that? |
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SYMC Head Moderator Board of Advisors |
{{LUCKYSTAR}}...
Yes.. we have missed you!! You know I think some things never really go away.. we just put them into a different perspective. All those years you wished, hoped, worked for the kind of marriage you wanted and never had... When the contact begins to resemble the patterns we're so used to...those visions all come rushing back at you it is like the grief of all the pain of loss and sadness also does too. For me though.. I also have a great relief that I'm not in it anymore either. Abusive situations have a hell all their own. Gregory.. I think part of it also has to do with how long one was in that kind of a situation too... the nature of ones personality and what it took to finally get out of it. I've been divorced for 8 yrs. I still miss some things very much. I don't miss exH...not at all... especially when I hear from others that the abusiveness that still pervades his personality... but I do still grieve all the years and the marriage. Jules... I agree with everyone. Send something because you want to.. with no expectations... Loui "Everything's changed in a matter of minutes, nothing was saved in time. All of my old world and everything in it is hard to find, but they never...never were mine" "Before you knew me, an Angel came to me. I wrestled him down to the ground. He said he could cure me I said that don't worry me now." |
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Villager |
Expectations have long since vanished. No, that is not true. I hope that he will come to see that he has broken something that was good, for something that is exciting but is not based on on integrity and 'goodness'. I want to have an e mail like Lucky Star's. But I don't expect it.
He will reply if I contact him - he might even contact me, but I doubt it. When I hear from him, I will take in his words and then quickly delete the text/e mail. I will not feel good, I miss him so. But I want to do the right thing and not be blind-sided by my pain at his finding someone else. Our son was, as sons can be, beautiful and special. He would want his mum and dad to think of each other at this time. Thanks for the advice and care - it will be a hard day tomorrow but I will get through it and I hope that I can say the right thing to H when I need to. Our greatest glory is not in never falling but in rising every time we fall |
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Village Elder |
(((jules))) You demonstrate your love and compassion in your ability to put everything else aside in memory of your DS. I'll be thinking of you tomorrow. I'm glad I didn't get this e-mail earlier because it would've created all sorts of false hope. My XH is an addict/alcoholic who's lost almost everything that used to matter to him. I was lured back time and time again by his empty words ~ part of the abuse cycle. It's hard to hear them, to wish they were true, and that he'd sent them 6+ years ago... before I gave up and D'd him to save our business and my sanity, before DSS took his own life (after 2 years of NC from XH who probably just felt too guilty but hurt his son terribly), before XH lost his professional license and his health, even before his MOW left him. This is all way too little too late... but at least it helps me get over some of the lingering self-blaming. |
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