quote:

I'm glad I didn't get this e-mail earlier because it would've created all sorts of false hope.

I know what you mean. I didn't get an email, but I had lunch with XMIL the other day. I was crying a bit (in Apple Bees) just the tail-end of my grief, nothing earth shattering or mind boggling. I told her the truth, that I still love him (not in love with him) and care about him. And she said, "You should write him a letter and tell him that."

Not too long ago, having his mother say that to me, would have generated all kinds of hopes and musings that perhaps he felt the same way, why else would she say that, blah blah.

But I just looked at her and said, "He already knows all that."

It is not on me to do anything else in our R (or lack thereof) other than kid stuff. Period. End of story.

It is sad still, but a wonderful place to be.

{{{{{{{{{{jules}}}}}}}}}} No advice, just hugs.

Oh Luckystar

I am so sorry for your pain and understand now what a difficult e mail that must have been. And to lose your step son (is that right?) in such a way! How do you keep going after all that? My heart goes out to you.

The problem of whether to contact my H was solved because I had 3 text messages on my phone by 11.30. From my two kids and H. He said something like 'Hope today is ok for you, take care of yourself'. I replied that I was finding it tough but I hoped that he was OK. End of contact. The day was harder for hearing from him because it reminded me of all that I had lost. But it was better than not.

The rest of the day a good friend came round - her son is two weeks older than my son was and they were best of friends. We talked about my boy and also about H and the evening passed.

Thanks for kind thoughts everyone.

Well, irony of ironies. My decree absolute came through yesterday and guess what it was dated the 2nd of Dec - my son's anniversary. I contacted my husband to say 'nice timing' and he replied to say that he was sorry, he had specifically asked that that day be avoided.
Feeling pretty low now but at least all the bad things are over now.
Jules

Ugh, jules. {{{{{{{{{{jules}}}}}}}}}}

I'm sorry. I'm so sorry.

All of the bad *action* things might be over now (the separation, the divorce), but there is still much healing to be done. I have found my own healing to be a thing of intense pain, as well as intense growth and understanding. Seems for me at least, I cannot have one without the other. Probably because I have a thick skull......

Keep posting. We are all here for you.

Jules
Well I'm glad he texted you on the day. And as for the decree - well I'm sorry it's final and I'm sorry it's made that day even worse...
Maybe if there is a plus side (I'm trying to be positive, hope it doesn't sound flippant) - in the future, at least you just have the one miserable anniversary date instead of a few to drag on through! Better to have a bad day of the year than a bad period of the year, I reckon. Like having teeth pulled - gets it over with.....?

Jules,
Ouch. Gosh, I'm sorry the world was so thoughtless on Dec 2nd.

You got through it though. You're still standing....poised to keep looking ahead. Your strength and grace will carry you through - I just know it. The next Dec 2nd will look entirely different I bet.

Our calendar system is circular, but people and our lives are not. Time is linear - a straight line of progression. I hope you keep looking forward to brighter days.

Big hugs,
GS

Thanks for your kind replies. They do help.

Oddly, I have just received an e mail from OW repeating that x did not want divorce to fall on the anniversary and saying that she regrets the loss of my friendship. I started to write a reply but then left it and phoned a friend who made me feel more calm. I know that x and OW 'celebrated' with bubbly when they got the news of the decree absolute (don't ask how) so it is hard to reconcile that with her sympathetic message.

What does it all mean? Best to leave well alone and get on with surviving the run up to Christmas.

Hope you are all safe and warm,
Jules

Oh dear. Good move phoning the friend.
How do you know they celebrated? What a sad thing to celebrate, regardless of the day.

Yes, they are no longer your problem and whatever confused stuff goes on in their heads is no longer yours either. I wish I could reach over there and give you a real hug.

Ok - the reason that I know that they celebrated is that OW has a blog about their house renovation. So, every once in a while I have a look. I had been really strong and not looked for weeks, but I couldn't resist looking at her post for the day that we got the letter about the divorce. I will try really hard not to look again - I think I will succeed but it is out there. You could all look! She even has photos!

I am feeling happier today. I deleted her e mail with no reply and sent a business-like e mail to x who has not contacted solicitor re house sale. Feel very grown up!

Mags, as ever you are a treasure. Thanks for your reply. I will catch up with your thread (is it the longest ever on the forum?) and see how you are doing. I hope all is good.
love Jules

quote:

it is out there. You could all look! She even has photos!

Eh....no thanks. But then, I can't even stand to look at Angelina Jolie/Brad Pitt stuff either. It has an icky feel to it all that kind of makes me want to throw up a little bit.

Jules, I bet I'm not the only one who gets icky feelings about watching SOME affair relationships. Not always since I know some that have unique circumstances.

Most times though, the bubbly..the pretty faces...the "oh so wonderful" appearance - eh, probably not what it seems on the outside. The word fascade comes to mind, but that's not quite what I mean. There's like a silent undercurrent in these situations - people not speaking what they really think, but it's there nonetheless.

It isn't viewed as happily as the couple presents. A lot of people want to take a shower maybe after they've been around it for any length of time maybe....just...icky.

My mother used to say "The wheels of God grind slow, but they do grind exceedingly fine." What comes around...goes around. I can't imagine this is a happy ever after story for them...but that's their problem now, yes?

OK, now go take your shower and stay away from the blog. hee hee Good move on deleting the e-mail....it was trying to remove some guilt, but that really isn't your role now, is it?

I'm glad you are feeling better. Have you made some special holiday plans to look forward to perhaps?

All the best,
GS

Ugh, a blog! Sheesh what an additional temptation! I don't think I'd ever be able to resist. Even now I'm tempted to look. Must be that instinct like slowing down to see a car crash.
Well done holding out so often. And well done deleting - I don't think I'd have had the self restraint for that either - I think I'd have said something snide like "thanks for your message, ever so kind - hope you enjoyed your BUBBLY". And then of course I'd have just felt even grumpier after sending it!
So well done. You are VERY grown up!

Ah friends, I'm not as grown up as I thought. I went straight from writing on this site yesterday to having another look at the blog. What I read makes me think that x is happy with her, both feel guilt about what happened to me but they are happy together. Sometimes I just want him back and sometimes I feel like I am letting go. Mostly, I still want him back.

There are good things in my life, but if I list all that I have lost, I feel very down. However the worst is over and I am beginning the long slow ascent out of the darkness. On the plus side, I am meeting up with a friend who is part of my support system at the weekend and then going to buy my tree with friends on Sunday. DD is home from uni in a week, and she and I are now very close.

GS, you are right, they may have 'lurve', but I have other relationships around me. They do not fill the heartache, but they are all good, healthy relationships.

Mags, I will keep working on being grown up and will one day get there - hope its not boring!

Maybe they are happy together. These things do work out for some people.
More importantly - YOU will be happy too, some time. I think there will come a time when you can't even imagine H in your life. You may wonder - but you won't want. ESPECIALLY if you make an extra big effort to do all the stuff you always wanted to do but didn't. Your increased closeness with DD might be an example of this.

Then their happiness or not won't matter. It may sting because it seems so unfair - but hopefully there will be a stage when it doesn't matter.

I know - easily said - difficult to do!
Hehe - well I'll be right behind you working on being grownup too!

Emotional Abuse, Verbal Abuse: Very Early Warning Signs
By Steven Stosny on December 17, 2008 in Anger in the Age of Entitlement
the actual blog entry

Emotional abuse, verbal abuse, and domestic violence are on the rise, especially among young people. The risk of falling into an abusive relationship is greater than ever.

There are obvious red flags to avoid in a prospective lover, such as angry, controlling, possessive, jealous, or violent behavior. Unfortunately, most abusers are able to mask these tendencies in dating. By the time many people notice the obvious red flags, they're already attached to an abuser, which makes it much harder for them to leave the relationship.

More useful than a list of obvious red flags are guidelines based on very early warning signs of a potentially abusive relationship, signs that are visible before an attachment bond is formed. The following is a list of qualities to look for in a potential lover. Avoid them at all costs.

Note: During the early stages of your relationship, your partner is not likely to do any of these things to you. But witnessing these attitudes and behaviors toward others is a sure sign that they will turn onto you, sooner or later.

Very Early Warning Sign #1: A Blamer
Avoid anyone who blames his negative feelings and bad luck on someone else. Special care is necessary here, as blamers can be really seductive in dating. Their blame of others can make you look great by comparison:

"You're so smart, sensitive, caring, and loving, not like that ***** I used to go out with."

"Why couldn't I have met you before that self-centered, greedy, woman I used to date?"

"You're so calm and together, and she was so crazy and paranoid."

Hearing this kind of thing might make you think that all he really needs is the understanding and love of a good woman to change his luck. This disastrous assumption flies in the face of the Law of Blame.

The Law of Blame: It eventually goes to the closest person.

When you become the closest person to him, the blame will certainly turn on you.

Blamers can be dangerous to love because they usually suffer from victim identity. Feeling like victims, they see themselves as justified in whatever retaliation they enact and whatever compensation they take. Blamers will certainly cause pain for you if you come to love one.

Very Early Warning Sign #2: Resentment
Resentment is a negative mood caused by focus on perceptions of unfairness. Resentful people feel like they are not getting the help, consideration, praise, reward, or affection they believe is due them.

Everyone has to put up with a certain amount of unfairness in life. We don't like it, but we deal with it and move on; we try to improve our situations and our experiences. The resentful waste their emotional energy by dwelling on the unfairness of others (while remaining oblivious to their own unfairness). They think (mistakenly) that they don't know how to improve their lives. They use resentment as a defense against a sense of failure or inadequacy.

Resentful people are so caught up in their "rights" and so locked into their own perspectives that they become completely insensitive to the rights and perspectives of others. If you fall in love with a resentful person, you will eventually become the brunt of that resentment and almost certainly feel shut out and diminished in the relationship.

Very Early Warning Sign #3: Entitlement
People with a sense of entitlement believe that they deserve special consideration and special treatment. They may cut in front of others waiting in line, smoke wherever they want, drive any way they want, say anything they like, and do pretty much anything they choose.

Driven by high standards of what they should get and what other people should do for them, the entitled feel chronically disappointed and offended. So it seems only fair, from their myopic perspectives, that they get compensation for their constant frustrations. Special consideration seems like so little to ask! Here's the logic:

"It's so hard being me, I shouldn't have to wait in line, too!"

"With all I have to put up with, I deserve to take a few supplies from the office."

"With the kind of day I had, you expect me to mow the lawn?"

"All the taxes I pay, and they bother me about this little deduction!"

"The way I hit the golf ball, I should get the best seat in the restaurant!"

"I'm the man; you have to cook my dinner!"

After the glow of infatuation wears off, the entitled person will regard his feelings and desire as more important than yours. If you agree, you'll get depressed. If you disagree, you'll get abused.

Very Early Warning Sign #4 Superiority
Superiority is the implication, at least through body language or tone of voice, that someone is better than someone else. Potential abusers tend to have hierarchical self-esteem, i.e., they need to feel better than someone else to feel okay about themselves. They need to point out ways in which they are smarter, more sensitive, or more talented than others. This, too, can be seductive in dating, as he will point out ways in which you are superior, too.

The most abusive form of hierarchical self-esteem is predatory self-esteem. To feel good about themselves, persons with predatory self-esteem need to make other people feel bad about themselves. Many will test high in self-esteem when they come for court-ordered treatment, while everyone else in their family tests low. But once intervention increases the self-esteem of the emotionally beaten-down spouse and children who then no longer internalize the put-downs, the predator's self-esteem invariably declines.

A variation on this very early warning sign is self-righteousness. If you dare to disagree with him, you will not only be wrong but immoral!

Very Early Warning Sign #5: Pettiness
If he makes a big deal out of nothing or focuses on one small, negative aspect of an issue, a relationship with him will be disastrous. This might show itself as being extremely particular about how his food is prepared in a restaurant or seeming impatient if someone drops something.

In a love relationship, his petty attitudes and behavior will make you feel reduced to some small mistake, as if nothing you have ever done right in your life matters. You will feel criticized and diminished for the smallest of infractions, real or imagined.

Very Early Warning Sign #6: Sarcasm
Sarcasm comes in many forms. Sometimes it's just poorly-timed humor - saying the wrong thing in the wrong context. Sometimes it's innocently insensitive, with no intention to hurt or offend. More often it is hostile and meant to devalue. The purpose is to undermine a perspective the sarcastic person doesn't agree with or to shake someone's confidence, just for a temporary ego gain or some strategic advantage in a negotiation.

Sarcastic people tend to be heavy into impression management, always trying to sound smart or witty. Their tone always has at least a subtle put-down in it. In dating this will be directed at others. In a relationship, it will center on you.

Very Early Warning Sign #7: Deceit (intentional and unintentional)

Unintentional deceit happens all the time in dating, due to what I call the "dating self."

We all try to put on the best face possible in dating. Most of us will exaggerate our good qualities at least a little, if we think the other person will like us more if we were just a bit more like that. "Oh, you're religious? Well I've been feeling a bit more spiritual lately, so I'm going right home and read the Bible, or at least watch the movie version."

This kind of unintentional exaggeration is meant less to deceive than to motivate the self. The exaggerator really wants to develop qualities you like; he's just not quite there, yet.

Of course, the dating self often includes blatant deception, as in, "Oh, did I tell you that I went to Harvard?" or, "Yes, I know some rich and famous people." Deceit shows a low level of self-respect -- and respect for you -- that can only bode ill in a relationship.

Very Early Warning Sign #8: Minor Jealousy
Minor jealousy does not come off like the obvious red flag of controlling and possessive behavior. It looks more like this: He's slightly uncomfortable when you talk to or even look at another man. He might not say anything, but he looks uncomfortable.

The tough thing about minor jealousy in dating is that you actually want a tiny bit of it to know that they other person cares. (You certainly don't want to love someone who wouldn't mind at all if you slept with the entire football team.) But a little bit of jealousy goes a long, long way. Think of it as a drop of powerfully concentrated liquid in a huge bucket of water. More than a tiny drop will poison any relationship you might develop with the jealous person and, more important, put you in harm's way.

Even minor jealousy has the potential to be harmful. Jealousy becomes dangerous once it turns into obsession. The more we obsess about something, the more imagination takes over, distorting reality and rational thinking. Jealousy is the only naturally occurring emotion that can cause psychosis, which is the inability to tell what is really happening from what is in your head. Most severe violence in relationships involves some form of jealousy.

Very Early Warning Sign #9: Rusher
I have had clients complain that their boyfriends don't pursue them or try to sweep them off their feet. I always tell them, "How lucky you are!"
Guys who go "too fast" (defined as whatever makes you uncomfortable), do not respect boundaries. One definition of "abuse" is "that which violates personal boundaries." It is not flattering that someone wants you so much that he does not care about whether you are comfortable. Make sure that any man you become interested in shows respect for your comfort-level, in all senses of the word.

Trust in Yourself
While a certain caution in dating is a good thing, you want to be sure that your caution is proactive, rather than reactive; you want it based on trusting your instincts, rather than distrusting love.

Trust in yourself stems from your deepest values. As long as you stay attuned to the most important things to and about you, you will naturally gravitate toward those who truly value you as a person.

But even if you are firmly grounded in your values, it's possible to be fooled by hidden resentment, anger, or abusive tendencies in the people you date. That's because it's easy for those prone to such tendencies to put on a false dating face. Because they have a more "fluid" sense of self than most people, it's easier for them to pour it into any container they think you might like. But they can't and won't stay in a nice container once you establish a relationship. Then their resentment, anger, or abuse will emerge in full force.

Multiple-Victimization
Research shows that if a woman has been mistreated in the past, even in childhood, there's a good chance that she'll be mistreated in her next relationship as well. It's called, "multiple-victimization," and it is often misunderstood.

I have heard far too many women clients say things like, "I could walk into a room full of doctors and therapists and fall in love with the one criminal."

Or they ask with sad and bewildered eyes, "Why do I only attract resentful, angry, and abusive partners?" They wonder if they put out signals that say, "Please abuse me!" This particular misconception has even infected a few professionals who have ridiculously theorized that some women "want to be abused."

If you've experienced multiple-victimization, please understand this: The problem is not that you attract only resentful, angry, or abusive suitors; it's that, by and large, you have not been receptive to the gentler, more respectful men you also attract. This is not due to your temperament or personality; it's a normal defensive reaction. After you've been hurt, of course you'll put up subtle barriers for self-protection. Non-abusive men will recognize and respect those barriers. For example, suppose that you work with someone who's attracted to you. But he senses that you're uncomfortable with his small gestures for more closeness. He will naturally back off and give you time to heal, or he'll settle for a non-romantic friendship. But a man who is likely to mistreat you will either not recognize your barriers or completely disregard them. He will continue to hit on you, until he breaks down the protective walls that surround your hungry heart.

The following "intimacy test" can help you become more sensitive and trusting to the non-verbal signals about attachment that ultimately rise from your core value.

Intimacy Test
Can you disclose anything about yourself, including your deepest thoughts and feelings, without fear of rejection or misunderstanding? ________

Is the message of your relationship, "grow, expand, create, disclose, reveal?" Or is it, "hide, conceal, think only in certain ways, behave only in certain ways, feel only certain things?"

Grow___ Hide ___

Does this relationship offer both parties optimal growth? ___

Can you both develop into the greatest persons you can be? ___

Does your partner fully accept that you have thoughts, beliefs, preferences, and feelings that differ from his? ___

Does he respect those differences? ___

Does he cherish you despite them? ___

Does he accept your differences without trying to change you? ___

Do you want to accept that your partner has thoughts, beliefs, preferences, and feelings that differ from yours? ___

Can you respect those differences? ___

Can you cherish your partner despite them? ___

Can you accept them without trying to change them? ___

A greater sense of your core values will give you more confidence that you can detect the very early warning signs of abuse. Listen compassionately to the faint messages of your hungry heart. Then it won't need to make the kind of desperate outcries that suspend your best judgment, scare off appropriate matches, and attract resentful, angry, or abusive partners.

Now
here is the tricky as well as risky part of reading such articles as the ones Stosny writes and shares.

Do you as the reader DARE to read the article from the perspective of the potential or present "abuser"?

When you read such an article, do you DARE ask yourself "what should I do, or be doing differently so that I am less abusive in a relationship?"

Well Jules.. If this is any help whatsoever..

2 couples that I know of.. who started out as emotional affairs, turned to PA's.. left their spouse's, got married.. were "oh sooooo happy".. its been about 3 yrs for one, 6 for the other... lets see.. one of them is having HUGE $$ troubles and the other.. we heard thru the grapevine, she threatened to leave during an argument.

So.. things are not always what they seem on the surface. And just like every other relationship on the planet, aren't always filled with happy, starry-eyed faces.

Sometimes, it just takes a long time to happen.

Loui

Loui

Thanks for encouragement. I have had a mostly good Christmas, but am steeling myself for the visit of my x to our kids. It still feels very strange that he doesn't want to/need to see me or communicate. But my new life is just around the corner (literally, in that my new house is just 4 streets away - hopefully move in second week of Jan). I have a way to go before I fully understand this love thing but I know that I can take what I have learnt into any future relationship.

Seasons greetings to all SYMC friends - you do a brilliant Job!
Jules