See what I just posted in your thread Eav.

I'm pretty much exhausted today. Aside from the emotional roller coaster I allowed myself to get on. I've been redecorating my kitchen to keep myself busy. It's going pretty good. I got part of my cabinets painted today. Between that, the kids and being on the phone w/ H I pretty much had 3 things going at once all day long.

I'm really in awe of single moms!

I have a simple, short suggestion for you:

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And if that's not what you want then it won't work."

stop predicting the future...you can't do it...or rather, the more you predict, the more it plays out exactly as you predicted...

telling him negative things can only have a negative impact...on him and on you and on your M...

awed

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telling him negative things can only have a negative impact...on him and on you and on your M...

That does make sense!

Lawyer appt has been postponed until Wed.

My uncle is dying. He has been batteling cancer for 5 years. He's done radiation and chemo. They found it's spread and there is nothing more they can do now. He has been having fluid build up in his lungs for the last few days. He chose not to go on a vent b/c the Dr's told him he would never be able to go off it. He chose to be put on pain meds and go peacefully-- his words.

So I felt I needed to be around in case my cousin, who is more like my sister, needs anything.

Say a quick prayer (or whatever you do) for my family please. Thank you.

Hey sweetie,

haven't been around this weekend, so just catching up... I'm sorry about your uncle..it's very hard to go through. All I can do is

I'm thinking about something you mentioned earlier in the thread about approaching your mom's friend for info...what info do you need from her that you don't already know? and will it just cut you some more where there are already open wounds? Just a thought....

When H says he wants to keep talking & trying with you have you asked him what he means by that? Or maybe telling him that you're all ears, how would he suggest you both go about this? Not that you're letting him be in charge of it, but it might be interesting to hear his ideas about "trying".

And something else too (which may be impossible in your current upset state, but I've noticed it)... They actually like stop and think when you are perfectly calm, perfectly collected and perfectly serious. I don't know why but it always seemed to me when I cried and was upset my ex had the "control", but when I was cool, calm & collected he sat back and went "whoa.."

EJLH

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They actually like stop and think when you are perfectly calm, perfectly collected and perfectly serious. I don't know why but it always seemed to me when I cried and was upset my ex had the "control", but when I was cool, calm & collected he sat back and went "whoa.."

Oh this is so true for me too. I try so hard to maintain that calm. But man oh man is it hard!!!!!!!!

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When H says he wants to keep talking & trying with you have you asked him what he means by that? Or maybe telling him that you're all ears, how would he suggest you both go about this? Not that you're letting him be in charge of it, but it might be interesting to hear his ideas about "trying".

i'd ask this also...

lookingbackat my situation...it seems when my husband said this meant the following:

1. I am still TRYING to make up my mind if i want you or the OW
2. I am still TRYING to see if my feelings for you comeback
3. I am still TRYING to buy some time to see if the OW is worth giving up everything for
4.I am still TRYING to have both of you

IT DID NOT MEAN
1. I will TRY to give up the OW
2. I will TRY things that may allow my feelings for you to come back
3. I will TRY comming home to see if we can make this work
4. I will TRY to treat you with respect
5. I will TRY to honor my marraige vows and treat you the way a wife should be treated

well...i am a teacher...and this is what i learned from my experiences

i agree....ask him!

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I'm thinking about something you mentioned earlier in the thread about approaching your mom's friend for info...what info do you need from her that you don't already know? and will it just cut you some more where there are already open wounds? Just a thought....

Yeah it'll probably just cut me deeper. It's not a good idea-- at least not for the marriage. I didn't do this and probably won't.

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When H says he wants to keep talking & trying with you have you asked him what he means by that? Or maybe telling him that you're all ears, how would he suggest you both go about this? Not that you're letting him be in charge of it, but it might be interesting to hear his ideas about "trying".

Bascially it means that he wants to hear something that would allow him to believe
his feelings are wrong-- that I do really want him, love him, need him, put him (and our M) first above everything else.

It's frustrating and part of why I'm still not in PP. He's reaching out to me and if I cut off contact he'll see that as me not reaching back. The logical side of me sees the good things about PP. But I know my H, his thought processes and how he handles things. If I go into PP he would file for divorce and not look back. Yeah, I'm predicting the future again-- I know. Do I *know* he'd do that? No. Am I afraid that's what he'd do? Yes.

And right now that fear has me in it's claws.

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Bascially it means that he wants to hear something that would allow him to believe
his feelings are wrong-- that I do really want him, love him, need him, put him (and our M) first above everything else.

what have you done to show him that his feelings are wrong?

i think you should tell him that by fighting for him...you are showing him these things.

what else can you do or say?

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It's frustrating and part of why I'm still not in PP. He's reaching out to me and if I cut off contact he'll see that as me not reaching back. The logical side of me sees the good things about PP. But I know my H, his thought processes and how he handles things. If I go into PP he would file for divorce and not look back.

i agree with you. i believe that my husband would be thrilled if i went into PP.

and he would believe that i had finally given up and moved on without him.

i'm with you j

but hey...what do i know...my marraigeis worse off than yours

sometimesi think we should be listening to those people who have been where we are and have gotten back together but we AREN'T are we??

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sometimesi think we should be listening to those people who have been where we are and have gotten back together but we AREN'T are we??

Uh, yeah. I feel this way everyday...

Well just a few things to ask...

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Bascially it means that he wants to hear something that would allow him to believe
his feelings are wrong-- that I do really want him, love him, need him, put him (and our M) first above everything else.

Did he tell you this or are you guessing this is it...I think asking him and getting a direct answer might help you to come up with an approach that might help you both.

Eav wrote about her husbands version of "trying" and her version of "trying" ..
The only issue I have with any of those statements is the trying word. Unless either party involved is past the trying and is actively doing, nothing will happen. Trying is just another word for sitting on the fence thinking. (my opinion)

And guys..I thoroughly understand your feelings about PP. Look where I am? My SO and I are going for a counseling session tomorrow for me to get a grip on guidelines. SO is going to his first recovery meeting...now there are positives and negatives to this...I am involved at this point in his recovery and I would like to extricate myself from it...hence the counselor visit. Had I stayed in PP eventually he might have done this by himself. Of course the possibility exists he might not have. Thats the crap shoot. And my recovery is still something I need to work on. I don't know if I can do it 100% with SO around 100% of the time. That will remain to be seen ...hence the visit to the counselor and the guidelines..

Do you see what I'm saying? In PP I had no involvement with SO's recovery, life, chaos. I had the time and chance to work on me, exclusively, on me. Right now I have any of SO's chaos (small as it is at the moment) and the threat (whether it's real or imagined) to explode at any time. That will impede my recovery..it has too. It's still waiting for the proverbial shoe to drop.

I cannot say my choice is the right one, or the better one at the moment. It is what I have chosen and I will follow it until such time that either PP becomes necessary for my well being or I that I no longer feel the threat of chaos in my life and thoroughly believe that SO and I are both in active, healthy recovery. That will take much work and convincing on SO's part for his end and much soul searching and realization on my end.

No we can't predict the future...probably just as well.

EJLH

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Did he tell you this or are you guessing this is it...I think asking him and getting a direct answer might help you to come up with an approach that might help you both.

he has told me this.

So let me get this straight...

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Bascially it means that he wants to hear something that would allow him to believe
his feelings are wrong-- that I do really want him, love him, need him, put him (and our M) first above everything else.

Which feelings does he want to believe are wrong? the ones for OW or the ones for you?

Obviously you have told him all the rest...what does he say when you've said this?

EJLH

He knows (or at least he says he does) the being with OW is wrong. The feelings he wants to be wrong are the ones he thinks I have. He has convinced himself that I don't love him, never wanted him and just kept around out of comfort and for the lifestyle. He wants that to be wrong and is desperatly searching for something in my voice, something I say to make himself believe he is wrong about me.

But he never hears it. And I know he never will as long has he's with her.

His other issue is how to let go of his anger/pain at me for the things I've done in our relationship. I won't go into all the details here. But suffice to say he has not been able to get past them. One of the things he has issues with was back in HighSchool--and we had broken up at the time. He's knows how stupid it is to hold this stuff for this long. But he doesn't know how to forgive it. He says he's tried all through our relationship, but he hasn't been able to do it.

We're both really good at blaming each other and not forgiving. Hence why I've been asking about it so much lately.

I was up late last night scribbling in my journal trying to make sense of my thoughts. I realized that part of our problems were due to my blaming him for things he had no control over-- my feelings. I was angry with him and didn't want to tell him. Instead of realizing that *I* held the power to tell him I blamed him that I couldn't do it. I felt he was at fault for it all. I was trying, he wasn't. Neither of us were trying! Instead we waited for the other to do something. I wrote in my journal, "In love there is no waiting. There is only doing." We didn't do a darn thing!

I realized last night that nothing would change unless I could forgive him for all the hurts he's caused me over the years, including the A. Even though it's still going on. And forgiving myself for all the hurts I've caused him.

I was pretty amazed at the effect it had on me. I don't know if I've ever given true forgiveness. Or if this one was just such a long time coming-- but I'm tellin' ya there was a feeling that washed over me that I haven't had in a very long time. Peace.

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I realized last night that nothing would change unless I could forgive him for all the hurts he's caused me over the years, including the A. Even though it's still going on. And forgiving myself for all the hurts I've caused him.

I was pretty amazed at the effect it had on me. I don't know if I've ever given true forgiveness. Or if this one was just such a long time coming-- but I'm tellin' ya there was a feeling that washed over me that I haven't had in a very long time. Peace.

powerful insight jasens!

perhaps this is the blockage that's been keeping you from PP? what do you think of the idea that you have something you need to say to him?

awed

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what do you think of the idea that you have something you need to say to him?

I'm not sure what you mean... that I forgive him or going into PP?

I told him all this in an email today...that he didn't have time to read. So I told him it all on the phone-- while he was driving to her house. *sigh*

Strangely I feel like I've become the OW now. He calls *me* on his breaks. He calls *me* on after he leaves work. He calls *me* if she leaves the house w/out him or he leaves w/out her. I haven't called him to talk about us in 3-4 days. I called him about my uncle and to pass along a message about some part for his motorcycle that was broke-- those are the only times I've dialed his number.

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But he never hears it. And I know he never will as long has he's with her.

i feel this way also...he will never hear that things could be better...becuse he already has better...with her

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His other issue is how to let go of his anger/pain at me for the things I've done in our relationship.

My husband also will not forgive me and is angry at me for not being there for him during my depression

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I realized last night that nothing would change unless I could forgive him for all the hurts he's caused me over the years, including the A. Even though it's still going on.

This is where i am also. I have forgiven him even though it is still going on. I understnad how it happened.

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And forgiving myself for all the hurts I've caused him.

this is what i have yet to do!

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"In love there is no waiting. There is only doing." We didn't do a darn thing!

wow j! this is very powerful!

it sounds as though you have some things that you ned to share with your husband now...even if he doesn't "hear you"

in love there is o waiting...only doing...

do it so you have nothing to regret!

Going for my consultation with the lawyer today at 4:30. It's 7am and I'm already a nervous wreck.

Blech. Didn't like the lawyer at all. I explained the situation, told her I was wanting a reconciliation, but wanted to have my ducks in a row in case things didn't go that way, I wasn't out for revenge and did not want this to be messy in any way if that's what it came to.
The first words out her mouth were, "When you file for divorce we'll want full custody. We'll want the court to see you're the better parent."

HUH?! After she saw I wasn't out to slit his throat she sat there like I was wasting her time. She answered my questions in about 15 mins.

Also I arrived about 5 mins early. She was leaving to go the post office. She was late for the appt!!!!!

Not impressed at all.

My uncle's funeral was this morning. To give you a mental picture of him he looked liked Gomer Pyle complete with the southern drawl. He was the most loving uncle and you never left without a smile on your face after talking with him. Even when he was in his last days he thought of others.

He gave my cousin a message for me that makes me giggle. He told her to tell me if he could have he would've kicked my H's a** all the way home. So that's not very respectful I know, but picture this skinny Gomer Pyle guy whose skin and bones from cancer saying that.

I told some of my family that H and I were separated. Didn't feel they needed the details of why though. They were all supportive. Even one of my cousin's husbands gave me a big hug and told me to call them anytime.

My little two-some absolutely adore my 2nd cousin. I used to babysit him and his little brother--both of whom tower over me now at 15 and 16. Nothing reminds you of your age fast enough when a kid that you used to change his diapers has *your* kid on his shoulders!!!!

Missed my H today very much. I really wanted his chest to cry into with his arms around me. *sigh* My two-some were pretty lovey dovey today though, so that made up for that some.