For the past few years now I have dealt with people in troubled marriages and tried my absolute best to help them. In doing so, I've encountered a lot of shock and dismay at my suggestions.

The people I work with are hurting very badly. The pain that their spouse has inflicted upon them is horrific, the damage is deep, the wounds are festering, and it seems as if there is no relief in site. Often, their spouse has done something they aren't sure they can bring themselves to forgive - infidelity, abuse, years of emotional and physical neglect, abusing the children, etc.

They are righteously indignant. In their minds, the best (and sometimes only acceptable - for them) way the situation can be resolved is for their spouse to come crawling back on his/her hands and knees repenting profusely and groveling for forgiveness.

The first thing that I always advise is for them to stop hurting their SPOUSE, to treat their SPOUSE with respect, and to begin doing things for their SPOUSE (not to be confused with conflict avoidance). HAVE I LOST MY EVER-LOVING MIND?! WHAT IN THE NAME OF ALL THAT IS HOLY IS WRONG WITH ME?! HOW DARE I SUGGEST THAT IT IS THEY WHO NEED TO MAKE A CHANGE?

They want empathy. They want sympathy. They want justice and retribution for damages. I'm sorry to say that I haven't got justice or retribution to offer or give. Justice is a nice ideal, highly subjective to the person wanting it, and not something that your own healing should depend upon. Justice may or may not ever come.

Now, when it comes to saving the marriage, I have something to offer. However, you have to start with yourself. The only person you can control is YOU, which makes it the ideal place to begin changes within the marriage (of which you are at least part).

As we all know, it is difficult when you are in the painful situation to realize that where there is one hurting spouse, there is usually another spouse hurting as well.

Saving your marriage rarely seems fair. Saving your marriage rarely means justice for the past. Saving your marriage rarely means retribution for damage done. It can help you move forward instead of staying in the past.

So, if you are in a situation that you do not particularly like, I encourage you to take a look at yourself, your actions, and your choices. Take a look at the value judgments you are making that keep yourself in that situation.

As for disrespect, I encourage you to maintain a respectful attitude towards your spouse to the best of your ability. I've found that it is difficult to be disrespectful in your thoughts and words that aren't shared with your spouse and then turn on the respect when you communicate with your spouse. It all has to do with habit, and if you are faking respect, it is usually noticable.

I'm done babbling for tonight.

____________________________
met 6-2-99, engaged 6-2-00, married 6-2-01, H moves out 3-26-02, H moves home 5-27-02, Recovered

The significant problems we face can not be solved at the same level of thinking we were at when we created them. - Albert Einstein

The definition of insanity is doing the same thing over and over and expecting to get a different result. Persistence is great, but you must persist with something that works.

Great spirits have always found violent opposition from mediocrities. The latter cannot understand it when a man does not thoughtlessly submit to hereditary prejudices but honestly and courageously uses his intelligence. - Albert Einstein

It isn't what is done to us that defines us, it is how we respond to it. - Takola

Tak,

I have the BEST story to add to your thread that totally illustrates this concept.

My H had an A with OW in another state. He moved out and left me with two kids, a mortgage three months behind, no money, and no job. At first I COLLAPSED, but after lifting my head up, getting a job, catching up the mortgage, and getting my life back in order...guess what??

(You all know. It's the course of all A's!)

He wanted to come home!!

At first I was thrilled that he loved me and wanted me back, but when he actually GOT home that wasn't the case at all. He said (and I quote here) "I'm only home because the kids deserve two parents. If you want me back as your husband, you have to prove to me that you are worthy."

SCRRRRREEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEECH!

WHAT!!!

Was he kidding me?? He was the one who had the A, not me. He was the one who left his children, not me. He was the one who was so cruel it was HORRIFIC, not me. Why in the WORLD would I have to prove anything to him!???

It took a little while, but eventually I got it

He may not have meant it this way, but eventually I realized that *I* had contributed to this mess too. I had to get real with myself, face my own self and my own mistakes, and change myself. I had to work on me. Furthermore, I couldn't "make" him work on him. If he chose to ignore his issues and not admit his mistakes and avoid responsibility, that was NO EXCUSE for me to treat him disrespectfully or judgmentally.

It sure feels exactly the opposite of what you'd like to do though!! Do you suppose that could be because recovery from an A is counterintuitive??



Selene

"Approach love and cooking with wild abandon..." --Dahlai Lama

selene_symc@yahoo.com

Of course it is counterintuitive. Our intuition places blame. Where there is blame - there is a greater responsiblity on that party to make ammends. This is our instinctive thinking.

____________________________
met 6-2-99, engaged 6-2-00, married 6-2-01, H moves out 3-26-02, H moves home 5-27-02, Recovered

The significant problems we face can not be solved at the same level of thinking we were at when we created them. - Albert Einstein

The definition of insanity is doing the same thing over and over and expecting to get a different result. Persistence is great, but you must persist with something that works.

Great spirits have always found violent opposition from mediocrities. The latter cannot understand it when a man does not thoughtlessly submit to hereditary prejudices but honestly and courageously uses his intelligence. - Albert Einstein

It isn't what is done to us that defines us, it is how we respond to it. - Takola

Wonderful post Tak. As hard as it is to hear, it's the truth!! Thanks for sharing your thoughts.

P.S.

Maybe I should have followed my question with a playful "wink" since "Recovering from an affair is counter-intuitive" is one of Penny's mantras. I thought if I asked it rhetorically, it would get people thinking--and seeing a real life example of it would help people understand.

Sooooo...



Selene

Selene,

I know you know that. I answered it, though, for the benefit of others.

Tak -
Remembered when you wrote the post about admiration. You said that the OP is admiring the WS and BS should too? I went ballistic on that one. ADMIRE WHAT?

But you were absolutely right. It took me awhile to do it, but it really works. WH and I are now talking peacefully. He has apologized over and over for hurting me.

We still have a long way to go (OW still in the picture), but WH says he wants to restore our marriage.

There are two kinds of respect. The first kind would be the kind we should extend to all decent living things. The respect that they are valuable. They serve a purpose. They deserve to be treated with dignity and have their humanity respected.
The other kind of respect is the homage paid to those who have qualities we like and admire. This respect goes beyond how we would normally treat a follow creature. In the extreme, it's how we treat people like Colin Powell.

For years, I tried to focus on the first kind of respect, and I had a great deal of success. Btu when I tried to demonstrate the second kind of respect, I ran into a problem. There were so many, many areas where I completely disagreed with my husband that it was very hard to respect him. Our values were and are different. We value different things. I honor his right to chose his own values, but I don't respect those values, nor does he respect mine. So, then I ignored every part of him I couldn't respect. LOL. This was not very successful. Imagine ignoring your spouse! Because that's what it came down too.

I don't know. Maybe it was just my situation because the choices he made were forced on me. Maybe if they hadn't been forced on me I could have been more respectful. Or maybe I just failed.

I think it is very prudent to differentiate between respect for a person's actions and achievements and just general respect that I believe all people should be accorded.

Respecting some is harder than respecting others.

Going back to the original post... it's hard for all of us, I think, to acknowledge that we are the architects of our own lives. Oh, we take much of the credit for the good stuff. But when we're hurting? That's harder. Particularly when we're hurting from something like an affair.

I helped create the conditions that led to the end of my marriage. I live with that knowledge every single day. And I've done everything anyone could think of to do (except sacrifice my relationship with DD) to save my marriage. To absolutely no avail.

And I live with that knowledge, too. Still, I'm slowly building a life that I do like, that I do value, and that will be, I hope, healthy for me and DD.

Respect is difficult when you're hurting. Respect for the spouse is, still, pretty clear to most people as a "good idea." What's even harder is respect for the affair partner. It's still important, though.

quote:

---

Respect is difficult when you're hurting.

---

This cannot be said often enough. When you are hurting is when respect is the most counter-intuitive. Ironically, that is usually when it counts the most.